Notarization of your complaint - Stories

[Elena]

Many people who live outside if the US ask me what "notary" means and how could they find one. I usually can only offer a limited help in that regard, mainly because I don't know how notaries work or how they are called in other countries.

So, I decided to start this thread so that someone who already been through the process of notarization can share their experiences, so the rest of us could learn by example.

So, anyone who has notarized your complaint (or any other document) and do not mind sharing, please tell us what country you are from, what a notary is called in your language, how you found a notary, and what the requirements and approximate costs of notarization.

[simongilks]

i live in the UK. and i am currently working on my complaint to the Russian police. i have yet to notarise it but i know what to do now. to find a notary in Bimingham UK i simply typed 'notary in Birmingham UK' in Google and searched for one that way. one of the results was a Yell.com page - and using this online directory - i located half a dozen notaries in the BIrmingham area. the Notary Public i chose to use in this instance is in the city centre on Colmore Row. notarisation - as i understand it - is the legalisation of a document so that it can be used in a variety of ways in countries that have signed up to the Hague Convention. i understand the costs are approx £45 per page with an additional cost for an Apostille - this is around £40 altogether - and an Apostille is an essential part of the notarisation process. Apostille means a certification. It is used in the sense i am talking about it to refer to the legalisation of a document for international use under the terms of the 1961 Hague Convention Abolishing the Requirement of Legalisation for Foreign Public Documents. "Documents which have been notarised by a notary public, and certain other documents, and then certified with a conformant apostille are accepted for legal use in all the nations that have signed the Hague Convention." (text from http://www.ukincorp.co.uk/s-4G-apostill ... rvice.html). in the UK a notary is often referred to as a Notary Public. after notarisation i then need to get my complaint/statement translated using a certified translator - and again i simply Googled for certified translation in Birmingham UK - and Google threw up a handful of decent links. the translation company should know exactly how to deal with a notarised document - and in my case they do - and they've been extremely helpful in explaining the process to me. i am now ready to get these things done. and if i learn anything new on the way i will post it up in this forum.

[Elena]

simongilks,

Thank you very much for the information. I must say that I am very, very concerned about the cost of the notarization on the UK. You mentioned that the notarization costs "approx £45 per page with an additional cost for an Apostille - this is around £40 altogether " - £40 total for the entire document? Regardless of how many pages?

I have talked to one scam victim who lives in a fairly rural part of the UK, and, according to him, the only notary that he was able to locate in his area was charging £80 per document. The guy almost decided to give up on the prosecution, because he was pretty much penniless (or whatever the British equivalent of that word would be) after the scam and didn't want to spend money on the notary.

Here, in the US, the cost of the notary is much more affordable, around $6-$7 per document, if my memory serves me right. So, for a victim from the US the cost of notarization is what, 10 times less than for someone from the UK?! I wonder why such great price difference would exist?

[simongilks]

yes - as i understand it - the Apostille itself costs around £27 - but there's an additional internal courier fee - of around £15 - which brings the total cost for the Apostille alone - to about £42. the charges for the notarisation - again as i understand them - from my research i.e. by speaking to people who appeared to me to be very well informed about the whole process - is £45 per page. my statement/complaint is four pages. so my costs before i pay for the certified translation are already around £220. certified translation costs come in at another £45 per page -so that's another £180 to shell out for - total costs then to get the document ready to send on is about £400. but as yet i haven't had anything notarised or translated - which means i can't verify these costs in any way. and - yes - i am penniless after being scammed - so i need to save a while as i want to pursue the case - but then there are the costs of the representative to find at a later date - plus the costs of notarising and translating the Power of Attorney (and this is another £90 for a one-page document) - the overall expense was initially a deterrent to me too - but i've decided to stick with it - and see how far i can take it -

[Elena]

Given the cost of the notarization, it might be cheaper to notarize the power of attorney in Russia - $25 for both the translation and notarization of the document.

[simongilks]

it does make sense - yes - so that's the best way forward with the Power of Attorney. as for the other costs - i will try to get some further clarification - and see whether i can't bring them down a notch or two. it might be a question of shopping around - to save a £ here and a £ there - but my instincts tell me the figures i have been talking about are about right. but until i have had the statement/complaint notarised and translated by a certified translator
i can't talk about anything with any certainty. i will post up the facts as soon as i have any i.e. when i have had the work done - and that will give everyone a clearer picture about the costs involved in making a complaint in the UK -

[simongilks]

this us an update on notarisation in the UK.

i have now spoken to a couple of Notary Publics and i have a clearer picture of the costs. John Hughes (1 Colmore Row Birmingham B3 28J) charges £75 for a one-page Power of Attorney. i need two forms of ID (passport and recent utility bill/bank statement) to take to the office with the Power of Attorney. there is no requirement for a witness to sign the document to be notarised but John Hughes advised me that an Apostille is a necessary part of the legalisation of the document. the charges relating to the Apostille are £28 for the Apostille itself and £18 for the courier service to the Foreign Office to have it validated.

i also spoke to Michael Pinsent (Fieldgate House, 61, Wellington Rd, Edgbaston, Birmingham, B15 2ER). he chargesa £150 per hour and reckons the notarisation of a one-page Power of Attorney will cost around £60. he had no clear idea of the costs of an Apostille and was concerned that witnesses might be required. and he also doubted the validity of a translation if it wasn't carried out in the UK and signed by me. he seemed sharp and and on the ball but seemed inexperienced in notarising a document for use in the Russian Federation. he asked me more question than i asked him - and suggested i go back to Elena and my representative to clarify certain issues.

i will use John Hughes. he's an easy going and confident guy who seems to know what he's talking about. he made the whole issue of notarisation appear straight forward and uncomplicated. and although his charges are slightly higher than Michael Pinsent's his manner is more relaxed and he appears to have experience in dealing with documents that will be used in the Russian Federation. he also suggests that the certified translation of the Power of Attorney is done in this country and sent off with the notarised Power of Attorney to my representative in Kazan.

i mentioned to him that my signed statement/complaint will be notarised and translated in Russia to save money. he seemed to think this would be fine and that it would cause no problems with the Russian authorities.

[simongilks]

Re: Elena's comment about having the Power of Attorney notarised and translated in Russia:

i have been told it is not wise to do this. i can't remember the reasons. but i have it from
John Hughes that it isn't a good idea. i should be more precise than this but i can't be right
now. all i know is that to validate it for international use it must be notarised here in
the UK - and translated here - and then sent out to the representative in Russia.

Elena - i'm sure you'll post any comments you have about this.

[Elena]

all i know is that to validate it for international use it must be notarised here in
the UK - and translated here - and then sent out to the representative in Russia.

I personally have seen 6 or 7 cases where the POA was translated in Russia, and they all got accepted by police just fine. As long as the original POA (in your native language) is properly notarized in your country, then the translation can be done in Russia. At least, as far as police seems to care.

But, having said that, let me not discourage you from performing a translation in your country if you have the opportunity to do so! If you prefer to do the translations in your country, I will not object to that plan at all.

[simongilks]

Elena - thanks for your comments - and it seems you are right. i can have the POA translated in, say, Russia. it makes little difference where it is translated as long as it is translated by a certified translator. i don't know where i got the idea that it had to be translated here in the UK. i thought John Hughes mentioned it.

anyway, John Hughes has now notarised my POA. it was a quick and simple procedure - i signed the document - John Hughes filled in the Place of Issue and the date. he applied the seal. and he countersigned it. and that was it. total cost - with Apostille with Foreign Office validation via courier service - £121. i expect to receive the Apostilled POA on Tuesday or Wednesday. you can use postal services for the Apostille from the Foreign Office but with the current round of postal strikes affecting deliveries here i opted for the courier service. i'd also like to see my file dispatched as soon as possible to my representative.

i'm keen to find out what savings i will make - with the help of my representative - when i have the POA and my statement/complaint translated in Russia rather than the UK. and, of course, my statement/complaint will also be notarised in Russia - again with the help of my representative - so i will save money here too.

[Elena]

anyway, John Hughes has now notarised my POA. it was a quick and simple procedure - i signed the document - John Hughes filled in the Place of Issue and the date. he applied the seal. and he countersigned it. and that was it. total cost - with Apostille with Foreign Office validation via courier service - £121.

Ouch, it is still a bit. But I am glad that it is done!

Did you need to bring a witness, or anything like that?

i'm keen to find out what savings i will make - with the help of my representative - when i have the POA and my statement/complaint translated in Russia rather than the UK. and, of course, my statement/complaint will also be notarised in Russia - again with the help of my representative - so i will save money here too.

How many pages will you have in total to translate now?

[simongilks]

Elena - thanks for your questions.

a: did i need a witness?

i didn't need a witness - but if there is a need for one - or even two - the Notary Public can act as at least one of the witnesses. and that's worth knowing i think for anyone outside the UK who may need witnesses. so if you need a single witness the Notary will act as your witness for you - according to Michael Pinsent - who is a Notary in Birmingham. although i didn't use Michael (and he is cheaper than John Hughes by about £15) he strikes me as a knowledgeable person who is keen to do business the right way - so he's always worth a try - for those living in and around Birmingham (UK).

b: how many pages do i have to translate from English to Russian?

with the POA and my statement/complaint i have seven pages that need translating. in the UK - using a certified translator - it will cost me around £45 per page - so that's £315. and that's quite a lot of money!!! so any savings on this will be welcome! it doesn't matter how much white space is on the page - it will always be £45 - so a page of double spaced addresses (i.e more or less the first page of the statement/complaint) will still cost £45 - as will a half page at the end of the document. i don't know what the prices for translation are in Russia for English to Russian certified translation but i reckon they will be pretty competitive!

[Elena]

Simon,

Thank you for clarification.

Let me check exactly how much the translation of 7 pages will cost in total, plus the notarization of the original English complaint. I will get back to you with that.

[Elena]

Simon,

Here is the deal for translations and notarization in Russia.

Translations from English, German, Italian, French - $15 dollars per page +/- a couple of bucks (no additional service charges)
Notarization (per document) - $20, +/- a couple of bucks (no additional service charges)

The prices may fluctuate depending on the dollar exchange rate.

For 7 page document you are looking at $105 for the translation, and $20 for notarization, for a total of $125.

How much would it be in pounds?

[wayne]

Right now that's just pennies over £75